Alpine Type R's anyone???

[Cyanide]

Do any of y'all have any experience with these? I've gave both the component set up and the two-way design a listen to many times over against other makes/brands, and for my musical taste and budget, I can't find anything that sounds better to my ears. Just wondering.....

[blackpepper]

Component speakers will keep the bass in the sound otherwise you'll need a sub to compliment the two ways.. anything will sound insane with the 10 speakers system in the niner.. I don't have experience with the alpine type R but technology is getting better every day and I used to have 2 way alpines in my ZJ.. I couldn't find a better make for my budget either.

[Cyanide]

Component speakers will keep the bass in the sound otherwise you'll need a sub to compliment the two ways.. anything will sound insane with the 10 speakers system in the niner.. I don't have experience with the alpine type R but technology is getting better every day and I used to have 2 way alpines in my ZJ.. I couldn't find a better make for my budget either.

Good deal Ryan! What I'm looking at doing is the components in the dash/front doors and the rear sound bar to replace the component style factory set-ups there, and then two ways in the rear doors. Not so much looking into a sub right now as I like having my cargo area for that exact purpose, though I have given thoughts of a Stealthbox down the road; way down the road. But, every time I hear my buddy's system, which is properly tuned and even when he cuts the subs off (for my music), my stuff still kick-ass and is extremely tight and punchy. DAMN!!!!!! :D

As for amp selection, I'm not sure if I'm going to go with the JBL 6-channel I've been looking at or possibly a pair of Fosgates or Alpine. Though right now my main focus is saving the $$$ for my new engine.

http://thespeedfreaks.net/images/smilies/devdude.gif Hehehehehehehehehe...................

[BUBBADOG]

I always used the type S in my grand and loved them

[TimmyB]

In my researching thru car audio forums I hear the type r's are good speakers. I go on diy all the time for info. I just did a nice system in my WK, I have componants front and rear, two amps hiden under a false floor i made in the cargo area, and temp sub box in the cargo area thats easily moved around when I need the seats down. For the front componants I have 6.5's, made a bracket out of 1/2" mdf and have both the mid and tweeter mounted to it side by side in the stock 6x9 location, and imaging is great. tweeters sound like they are up high in front above the dash. For the rears I mounted the 6.5 mid in the stock speaker location and mounted the tweeter on the door panel next to the speaker down low, sounds great back there.

I saved a ton of $$ searching on ebay daily, got all brand new JL gear for 1/3rd of the price. I actually already blew a front mid somehow and picked up a brand new set of jl xr's for $170 shipped.

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk37/tdiglar78/DSC01647.jpg

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk37/tdiglar78/DSC01646.jpg

[A-Mart]

I just installed a singer r12 in my wk, search my name for the build thread. I'm VERY happy with the type-r, however I wish I would have put it in a larger box.

[Grandcherokee51]

I have 6x9 type s and they bump i can only imagine what the R,s are like. Go for it!!

[Cyanide]

Hmmmm, now this is fawking weird!

Went back to one of the stereo shops earlier with one of my favorite cd's to give another listen to multiple speakers being driven by the same head unit and amp for a fair comparison (head unit is the Sony GT-630UI, which is the same as I already have and love, and the amp was a Fosgate P-400). Strangely enough, both the component and the two-way Type S's sounded better than the Type R's; much better bass response and crisper highs. Just for comparison, here's how a few of the other major brands sounded in a quick summary (all 6.5" or 6.75" speakers)...

-Infinity 6022I: Muddy, overbearing bass.

-Kenwood 1682IE: Entirely too much midrange response, lack of bass.

-Sony GT1626A: Decent sound but lacking hard-hitting punch considering the power supplied.

:thumbsup:

[Craig10114]

I use to work at best buy selling car audio - i always sent people to the S's over the R's.... They just seem to be not as power hungry, and sound a lot better.

I have the same pair of Type R subs that i bought 6 years ago.... they still POUND. 500RMS speaker thats never been given more then 250 and youd swear i had 2 12's or more in the trunk.

[TimmyB]

Not sure of your budget, but there is a set of used Focal 6.5's for auction on ebay right now. IMO Focals are supreme speakers, all of there lines sound good to me.

But in my research on audio forums I came across a site called partsexpress.com, that sells audio gear for very decent money. Its alot more involved going that route, by purchaseing mids, tweets and crossovers seperately. From what i hear its alot more involved, especially going active instead of passive, but the sound quality is far better since your tayloring it to your specific car and not using factory crossovers set for a "one size fits all" type deal.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-374&ctab=2#Tabs

I hear the mids in the link above sound great and are very cheap IMO.

[Cyanide]

Allow me to please quickly ask a question. What's the big deal about Focal speakers? I read good reviews about them but the quantity of reviews I can find is extremely limited. Just curious and as always, thanks again for any and all info...

Another small (lol) note.....

As for power consideration, I'm really undecided how much I'm going to push right this moment. The amps I tested on them the other week were both listed as 50W RMS x 4 channels; the Alpine MRP-F300 and the Fosgate P400-4 (in that order as well). I wasn't able to see where the crossover points or gain had been set at, but the Fosgate kicked much harder than the Alpine, and pretty much knocked Alpine out for amp selection for supposedly being equal power output. Anyway, something in the power range between 50-100W RMS/Channel is most likely what I'll be getting, provided I can crank the volume loudly and not distort. I'm also considering the JL Audio G6600 since that would allow me to only need but one amp for the three sets of speakers in here (I'm not concerned with a sub at this time, if ever).

As for sound quality, be it by additional amp power or just receiver, the Type S speakers sounded better. I apologize for not mentioning that earlier, btw. Reading reviews from the various audio sites online, the Type R's seem to be a really good speaker, especially with a lot of power backing it. I'm just going off of my observation from what I heard, especially since I listen to stuff different than most people I know (death metal and hardcore)! I prefer just enough (tight) bass hitting for the kick drums and bass guitar, moderate midrange for the guitars w/o making the already lowered tuning and distortion muddy, and very "high" highs for the snare, high hat, ride, and cymbals.

So, with all that said, which would y'all prefer and why between the aforementioned speakers (Alpine S vs Alpine R), ran as a component set-up in front door/dash and rear sound bar, then two-ways in rear doors. And then for amp(s), the following...

-JL Audio G6600 (55W x 6 @ 12.5v/75W x 6 @14.4v, S/N Ratio 104dB, THD 1%, Freq, Response 10-25k Hz)
-Fosgate P400-4 (50W x 4 @ 14.4v, 85dB, 1%, 20-20k Hz)
-Fosgate T400-4 (60W x 4 @ 14.4v, 85 dB, 0.5%, 20-20k Hz)
-Fosgate T600-4 (100W x 4 @ 14.4v, 85 dB, 0.5%, 20-20k Hz)

Any other good, high quality amps y'all can recommend that compare to these w/o breaking the bank please add into your comments. I'm only listing these since I've never heard a Fosgate-powered system that didn't rock AND sound clean, and JL Audio seems to have a good reputation as well. Thanks y'all! More later.....

[Matt]

Allow me to please quickly ask a question. What's the big deal about Focal speakers? I read good reviews about them but the quantity of reviews I can find is extremely limited. Just curious and as always, thanks again for any and all info...

They're limited because they are a bit more expensive and aren't carried by as many shops as say Alpine, JL, or Kicker.

As with any speaker, you need to listen to them for yourself before you purchase. What one person may like, another may hate.

Speaker selection is very subjective!!!

[Cyanide]

They're limited because they are a bit more expensive and aren't carried by as many shops as say Alpine, JL, or Kicker.

As with any speaker, you need to listen to them for yourself before you purchase. What one person may like, another may hate.

Speaker selection is very subjective!!!

Exactly for the last three sentences! I've heard people say the Alpine's suck, but for what I listen to they kick ass. Note that I also don't listen to heavy, pounding, thumping bass either, so what I listen for is entirely different than what I would consider the average or normal listener. Hmmmmmm, like my friends who all wanna build up these million watt, multiple sub systems and throw one in my Jeep lol :lol:

[Matt]

Exactly for the last three sentences! I've heard people say the Alpine's suck, but for what I listen to they kick ass. Note that I also don't listen to heavy, pounding, thumping bass either, so what I listen for is entirely different than what I would consider the average or normal listener. Hmmmmmm, like my friends who all wanna build up these million watt, multiple sub systems and throw one in my Jeep lol :lol:

All that matters is that they sound good to you, period.

haha, yeah, we all have friends like that.

[TimmyB]

Like Matt said, Focal's are just another brand of speakers in a certain price range. From all the Focal's I have heard at audio stores they can handle alot of power and sound great or also sound great with little power as well. Most people dont even look at Focal's just because of the price tag, so i was just letting you know they had a nice set on ebay if you even happened to hear them before and liked them. Thats all, wasnt pushing them. Go on youtube and look up Focal mids, I doubt you will see many mids that have that type of excursion.

And I think alot has to do with actually know what your doing with the install, when I first turned my system on I wondered why I wasted all this money on it because the stock system sounded better, took me awhile of messing with it for it to finally sound good and im still trying to tune it better.

[05wkguy]

I have direct expeience with all the brands you are guys are talking about, with the exception of the Focal's. My store has carried/is carrying all of them. Couple things to note-the RF 400-4 is rated at 50w x 4 rms but actual output on the birth certificates i saw had most at 85w or more rms. The alpine F300 is an actual 50w x 4. The extra power will make speakers perform differently,typically better so keep that in mind as you are listening to the speakers. If you like the R's-which are a great speaker AS LONG as you run them off 75w or more,you should consider the JL, VR series. The nice thing is,they are changing them over to a C2 series,name change only so there are deals to be had if you find a new set of VR's on clearance. My opinion is they sound better,and are in the saem price range as the type R's.

Also,the other RF amps you listed will be under-rated as well. Typical power ratings we saw were:
T400-4: 100w rms x 4
T600-4: 180w rms x 4

Again,my opinion,the JL will sound the best but not give you quite as much power as the RF's.

[jeeppro]

pioneer all the way
http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww338/troymd/14183644.jpg

[Cyanide]

pioneer all the way...

Sorry bro but I can't stand the way Pioneer speakers sound listening to my stuff. The Type S 2-ways sounded much better than the Pioneer component set up I heard as well. Please remember also, I'M NOT putting a sub in my Jeep. Just not going to happen....

;)

[Chaoul1]

You can also go with a Rockford Fosgate P3.

[Cyanide]

You can also go with a Rockford Fosgate P3.

P300-1 does me no good bro since it's a sub amp...

;)

I have direct expeience with all the brands you are guys are talking about, with the exception of the Focal's. My store has carried/is carrying all of them. Couple things to note-the RF 400-4 is rated at 50w x 4 rms but actual output on the birth certificates i saw had most at 85w or more rms. The alpine F300 is an actual 50w x 4. The extra power will make speakers perform differently,typically better so keep that in mind as you are listening to the speakers. If you like the R's-which are a great speaker AS LONG as you run them off 75w or more,you should consider the JL, VR series. The nice thing is,they are changing them over to a C2 series,name change only so there are deals to be had if you find a new set of VR's on clearance. My opinion is they sound better,and are in the saem price range as the type R's.

Also,the other RF amps you listed will be under-rated as well. Typical power ratings we saw were:
T400-4: 100w rms x 4
T600-4: 180w rms x 4

Again,my opinion,the JL will sound the best but not give you quite as much power as the RF's.05wkguy... Thanks! That's one thing I've always loved about RF; always under-rating their amps! Allow me to ask and everyone else this though: how noticeable is it between the RF 85 dB S/N Ratio versus the JL 104dB rating? Or does it really matter, especially since I've already lost a bit of my high frequency hearing due to jobs in years past???

Also, any big difference in power/performance between the RF Prime and Punch series other than the Prime having a fixed High Pass crossover, slightly more varied Low Pass range, and much higher S/N Ratio (70 dB)?

And finally, any idea why the Power/"T" Series are putting out more power than the Punch/"P" Series???

Thanks again!

:thumbsup:

[05wkguy]

OOOOOOOOOOO,that question opens up a whole new can of worms. I'll give you my thoughts and you take them and do with as you please.
Yes,you can hear a 20db difference in signal to noise ratio. IF the amp is hooked up in a house and there is no background noise. As soon as you put the amp in a vehicle and start the engine,all differences are totally lost. even if it is a bone stock vehicle,no loud exhaust or anything. So,what is the benefit? 104 is higher than 85 so it must be a better amp,right? Yes,but not because of s/n. For vehicular use the most important things are power output and noise rejection. Power-well like i said before,there's alot of background noise in any vehicle,so the more power the better it can drive the speakers at volume levels high enough to overcome all background levels (starts at about 80db and higher) AND still have some headroom for transients at those higher levels. Noise rejection because you need the amp to eliminate as much electrical noise as possible. No matter the quality of rca's and speaker wire and so on,there will always be some noise,and you need that to be as little as possible. Don't bother even looking at THD as it's a proven fact that the average person can't even hear ANY distortion below 3.0% and a trained ear can hear as low as 1.5%. Yes those numbers are correct.

SO-yes the RF amp will play louder but only slightly more so than the JL. The JL will sound "cleaner" and have room for transient peaks at high volume.

As for the RF Prime vs Punch. Several differences:
The Punch has much larger internal capacitance,larger output transistors,NOMAD,balanced inputs etc. If you want to get an idea of how well constructed an amp is,look at the combination of all the specs. Yes I know i just said that many of them don't matter but when they are ALL much lower than another model,it shows a general "light duty" build to it. It won't have the headroom at hi volume,and will go into "clipping" (distortion) sooner and more suddenly than the punch. Look at the 2 ohm ratings,they only jump up about 50%,where the punch jumps 100% (a good indicator of properly designed voltage rails and output transformers) Also look at the fuse ratings-the punch are almost double for every comparible model.
Same comparisons can be made from punch to power-everything is beefed up and it results in a better performing amp.

[Cyanide]

:thumbsup:

Thanks for all of the info and education concerning the amps bro! I'm really digging it all.

But let me open up yet another can of worms with a new question..... How are the RF speakers? I know I really need to listen to them (and I know Best Buy carries the P1653...not my first choice but can at least hear them). I was looking around last night and the T1652 caught my eye with the separate frame-mount tweeter and also it having, at least on paper, a larger frequency range than the Alpines, which still are choice unless I hear something that suits me better (R.F. T1652 @ 55Hz-22kHz versus Alpine Type S SPS600/SPS600C @ 70Hz-22kHz).

Thanks again bro!!!

:D

[05wkguy]

I have always been a fan of the Rockford Power series components. Really,really similiar in sound to the typre R's. I personally like the tweeter on the R's better but the mid on the RF's. Also,your subs are going to cover a frequency range up to about 80hz,so I wouldn't worry about the 20hz difference in response between the 2. BUT,weren't we talking about R's and not S's in the Alpine line-up?

[Cyanide]

I have always been a fan of the Rockford Power series components. Really,really similiar in sound to the typre R's. I personally like the tweeter on the R's better but the mid on the RF's. Also,your subs are going to cover a frequency range up to about 80hz,so I wouldn't worry about the 20hz difference in response between the 2. BUT,weren't we talking about R's and not S's in the Alpine line-up?

To summarize all of my previous posts so far.........

-Really curious now as to the R.F. T1652 sound and build quality versus the Type S component and/or coax set up.

-From what I've heard the Alpine Type S sounds better than the Type R, regardless of R.F. P400-4 power versus mere receiver power.

-Will have NO SUBS in my Niner, just the six 6.5" speakers in the factory locations. I listen to Death Metal, NYC/NE Hardcore, 70's and 80's Classic Rock, early Hard Rock/Heavy Metal. True, I know a properly tuned sub will make a world of difference but I've heard plenty of kick-azz systems for what I listen to that had no sub(s) that still sounded great! I just honestly don't feel a need to cover anything lower than 80hz with my choice of music...

:thumbsup:

[05wkguy]

To my ears there is a huge difference between the S's and R's.