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  #13  
Old 05-02-2012, 08:47 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

Sorry, I am really not sure about the stock cam specs. You can probably do a internet search and come up with the specs. though. I am sure it is "straight up", and one tooth (~7 degrees) should bring some results. I am not sure about going 2 teeth, but I am sure it would work on the stock cam. It just may be a little too much advance though. Would be fun to experiment, again if I had another Hemi laying around. As a guide or reference, I think I'd bump the stock specs up against a mild aftermarket cam (like the Sidewinder) and see how the timing compares. Remember, earlier opening (to a point) will deliver more low end torque. You could back the Sidewinder specs. up ~10 degrees and that's where mine is on the Maggie. Then see how many degrees it would take to get the stocker to a similar position. Not very scientific, but it should give you a good idea of how far to go.
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  #14  
Old 05-03-2012, 12:59 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

Well, i did some googling and found that the stock (05at least) hemi cams have:
196/196 dur @.050
113 lsa
.477/.462 lift
124 - int centerline
also found -valve timing:
int -open BTDC 5.0* closes ATDC 255.0*
exh- BTDC 236* 32*

When looking up "05 hemi stock cam timing".... this thread popped up 3X's
everything else kept going to that damn vvt or aftermarket install articles.

anyone know a good (free) place/program to play around with this to see what it does?
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  #15  
Old 05-03-2012, 01:58 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

I would think advancing the stock cam may provide superior low end to stock, but top end would drop off like a brick due to the short duration. Might not be good for those who have intentions of racing. For those that just drive around town, it'd probably be a beast.

Even a small cam like a 6.1 OEM grind advanced would work well (this is a proven setup in the Rams) while providing at least stock or greater gains at higher rpms too.

I'd also like to see someone try to use a short-duration, tighter LSA cam like a KRC 210X in a Jeep to see how it does on mileage. The lower LSA would bring on the tq peak earlier and stronger.
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  #16  
Old 05-03-2012, 05:23 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

I agree with Ryan, especially the shorter duration somewhat killing what little top end the stock 5.7 has. I do think the bottom end, say ~0-80-85 mph would be a killer though. A guess is that the revs. would begin to flatten out slightly above 5000 RPM but, IMO with the WK gearing, there wouldn't be too many so-called factory hot rods that would be able to keep up. (Caveat: must do cam and complete exhaust) How much driving does anyone (except maybe me) do that's above 5000 RPM. Dang, I love to have my foot in it. Only two 6200 RPM first gear runs today though.
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  #17  
Old 05-04-2012, 01:04 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

Well,now that my balloon is popped.....

What can the stock 5.7 valve train handle? I see several cams where it says they can be used with stock springs, but they only showed duration, not lift #'s ...except from good ol ma mopar # P5153325AB 204/210.5 dur and .500/.488 lift with 116lsa I really would like to NOT have to change the springs n stuff @ this time,but now the bug bit me so i'd like to do something while i'm in there
I found this article where they swapped several comp cams, but didnt seem to change springs.....what do you think? with the longer dur. they could be advanced and have the best of both worlds,right?
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng...i/viewall.html


Oh, i love to romp on it, but i drive cross country several times a year, so i need a good balance
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  #18  
Old 05-04-2012, 04:10 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

This is just me, but I wouldn't use ANY cam other than stock without upgrading to at least 6.1 springs. Just my .02

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4.whoa View Post
Well,now that my balloon is popped.....

What can the stock 5.7 valve train handle? I see several cams where it says they can be used with stock springs, but they only showed duration, not lift #'s ...except from good ol ma mopar # P5153325AB 204/210.5 dur and .500/.488 lift with 116lsa I really would like to NOT have to change the springs n stuff @ this time,but now the bug bit me so i'd like to do something while i'm in there
I found this article where they swapped several comp cams, but didnt seem to change springs.....what do you think? with the longer dur. they could be advanced and have the best of both worlds,right?
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/eng...i/viewall.html


Oh, i love to romp on it, but i drive cross country several times a year, so i need a good balance
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  #19  
Old 05-04-2012, 09:32 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

I'll concur with Ryan again on the use of stock vs. aftermarket/6.1 springs AND pushrods. While you can run stock springs on a longer duration, higher lift cam, it is certainly not recommended. I have heard of a few doing it, but only temporarily until they could change them. You'll end up with a high chance of valve float and/or p to v collision if you run the RPM up too high with the stock springs. Don't know if you could coil bind them or not though. It's not that big a deal to change the springs with the heads on. I did it to both my Hemi's, the Jeep actually being easier than the Magnum. At the same time I changed the valve seals and the pushrods.

I too do a lot of highway driving, mostly trips ranging from ~200-2000 miles...about 8-10 times a year. That's one of the main reasons I tackled this experiment.

4.whoa, your balloon is not popped. Just a small amount of air let out of it. All this can be done without a huge expediture. I did both my cams and complete kits, with the Crower advance kits for a little less than $1000. Gaskets, valve seals, etc. was about another $100. Doing this mod. with stock cam and leaving the springs alone shouldn't cost $200 if you use the Crower kit, or around $100 if you just advance the stock timing set. Changing water pumps and belts, etc. would be extra though.
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  #20  
Old 05-04-2012, 10:57 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

what is the main difference in a 6.1 springs ? just the spring pressure ?
while $1k is not a huge amount , I have it earmarked for rims( 1st things 1st)
maybe I'll just advanced it 2* ,that shouldn't kill top end too much, right ?

I ran across something while searching that said a 6.1 damper on a 5.7 ,is 5% under driven however elsewhere I saw a damper listed for both the 5.7 and the 6.1 anyone know for sure ? I would imagine an underdrive pulley would help a little in the mileage department as well .
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  #21  
Old 05-04-2012, 11:20 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

If you're going to go through the trouble, I'd go get a ATI damper. Quality piece, balanced well, and more of a underdrive.

I would open the exhaust further before attempting to work on the cam timing.
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Old 05-05-2012, 02:23 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

X2 on the exhaust before the cam timing. Also, at 2 degrees you probably wouldn't notice much difference at all on either end. I'd go a minimum of 6, or not at all. Remember, my cam had 4 degrees ground into it by the mfg., so 2 degrees gave it a total of 6 degrees. The Maggie at 10 degrees total is way better, IMO, but you can't get there easily with the stock cam. I considered the underdrive pulley, and maybe I'll do it later. I'd like to know if anyone has measured the benefits as far as performance and FE?? It's a fairly easy swap if/when the time comes.

Edit: Oh, sorry, the 6.1 springs have more spring pressure and have bigger diameter coil material. The $1000 was for both vehicles, so one would be a lot less. My wheels are going to be the last thing I do. I screwed up when I bought it and bought new tires almost immediately. Now I have to wait until I wear them out. Bummer!!
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  #23  
Old 05-08-2012, 03:46 AM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

I've been refreshing my memory by rereading some cam stuff.

If a cam has an LSA of 113* (stock) and is installed with the int centerline @113* then it's "straight up"
But, the stock cam is installed @124* ,so it's already advanced 9* as it is.

I havent been driving my baby since it has a water leak, so i'm gonna take her out today and play around-see where she pulls. I'm thinking that i might give it another 4* (we'll see)
I know you have bigger/different cams,but the 4* diff in your 2 gave the power band a 400 rpm shift lower, not that it will be a match,but thinking it should be similar.

I have done a cat back already and ,while i have plans for srt mani's, I dont see how advancing the cam will need that 1st, without changing to a bigger cam, the airflow wont really change, so while it's no doubt benificial , i think i'll do this while im working on it ,and get that on the short list.

I have a bad habit of " while this is apart,thats the next part,so..." and one thing leads to another,so I'm gonna draw myself a line at advancing the stock cam and save the cam/lifters/springs/porting for another time.
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  #24  
Old 05-08-2012, 05:53 PM
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Re: Mods for the Adventurous Experimenters

I did a search for "crower adjustable timing set 5.7 hemi" cant find it for sale, just forum talk. Where can i get it?
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